Re: Fw: Net Epic 5 Beta Version Comments (long)

From: Jarreas Underwood <jarreas_at_...>
Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 09:32:07 -0400 (EDT)

>> Here are some comments for the Beta Version of Net Epic 5. Should I post
>> these on the Yahoo board as well?

Thanks, and yes.

As a general comment, all special characters, new units, stats and things that weren't available when we went over an army book will appear in the Optional Rules Book. All model proxies and painting suggestions will appear in the Hardware Book.


>> If possible could you make some new cards for the new units?
>>
So far there aren't any cards for any armies. AFAIK nobody has made cards for 5.0 yet, and I don't have the templates for the version 4 cards to expand the set. I'll get around to including the new units in my personal sets of cards, but that won't happen until late summer or fall and the format probably won't be the same as you're used to. If this is something you really think should be done, you should give it a try and see how it goes. The guy (can't remember his name) that's doing the model books should have lots of pictures to share.

>> What happened to the Psychic Phase? No one has explained to me why that
>> phase went away. When do psychic attacks occur?
>>
Psychic units may use their powers when they're activated in the movement or combat phases. Some powers say "anytime" and mean just that - at any time - but this shouldn't get into a 'outspeed your opponent' test.

From what I can tell the Psychic Phase went away because it make Psykers a little unbalanced. They were allowed to use their powers before your opponent had a chance to shoot 'em, making them unstoppable except by other Psykers. Now, your opponent has the chance to activate a unit and shoot your Psyker before he can use his powers.

>> I don't like the 25 point increments. Makes things more difficult.
>>
Neither do I, but that's how the discussion went.

>> Remember also in the Gospel Rules I sent - we doubled the movement for
>> all the flyers to make it more realistic.
>>
That wasn't ever put to the list for discussion, but I can put a comment into the Optional Rules Book.

>> Why did you get rid of Titan battle Honors?
>>
Didn't know about 'em. They vanished prior to version 3, which is when I started looking at the NetEpic rules.

>> Core Rules:
>>
>> Pg 14 - Why can't skimmers and Jump Pack troops end their movement on
>> prohibited terrain? What does it matter?
>>
It's because the rules are styalized and don't take real life into account all the time. Personally, I can understand jump troops not landing in prohibited terrain - it's a little difficult to land at 90mph into trees or swamps. Technically, yes, skimmers should be able to hover over terrain, but the movement concept seems to be the same as in Warhammer Fantasy: units go up, over and (unless they're fliers) land at the end of their movement. This is a little unrealistic, but makes for a definitive rule about who can move where.

As with most other things, if you disagree with it you should make a house rule. Suggest it to the list, have some discussion and it may well become an optional rule next revision.

>> Why did you guys come up with the different Titan weapon costs? This
>> seems to be more of a pain than it is worth.
>>
Points costs for the various weapons were given back in the origional Adeptus Titanicus rules, and while they've changed since then the relative costs have been around since NetEpic began.

>> Page 38 - I think there is an error in the Stupid description. Shouldn't
>> that be 3+ Charge Orders?
>>
I think you're right.

>> Adeptus Militaris:
>>
>> For the Superheavy Companies, did I read you correctly that the Commissar
>> rides in one of the tanks?
>>
Look in the army card listings - none of the superheavy companies get Commissars. The comment in the Commissar description applies to the Gorgon and Mole companies, and perhaps should be edited to be more applicable.

>> Page 20 - If a Valkyrie transports 2, how can an airborne platoon have 9
>> tactical stands? Shouldn't thank be 6?
>>
Well, shucks. Bad math on my part. I've added 2 more Valkyries to the squadron and upped the platoon to 10 tactical stands and 5 Valkyries. I kept the price the same, but it's an optional unit in the first place so if it's too cheap folks won't use it.

>> What does ROF 2 mean? Fires 2 time per turn? That needs to be put in
>> the description section.
>>
I assumed wargamers would understand standard abbreviations such as RoF, ETA, MPH, 3D6 and the like.

>> Page 25 - Stats for the Medusa are not in the table.
>>
It's listed twice - once (mistakenly) under vehicles and once under heavy artillery. The heavy artillery one is correct and has the stats.

>> Adeptus Astartes:
>>
>> Make sure paint schemes for all the new chapters are included.
>>
Nope. I've listed paint schemes for the origional chapters, and a reference to an online page where all the Warhammer 40k chapters are listed.

>> Adeptus Mechanicus:
>>
>> Page 9 - I like the 12 cm idea for the Multiple Rocket Launcher!!
>>
Thanks.

>> Page 13 - Why did the rules evolve to include points for various weapons?
>> I'm not a fan of this.
>>
Some weapons are more effective than others, so you should pay more to have 'em. If you don't like it, make a house rule that titans get free weapons.

>> Tyranids:
>>
>> Page 7 - Genestealers and Lictors - How can these creatures be slave
>> creatures and independent?
>>
"Slave" (as opposed to Synapse) means that you have to use Command Points to include them in your army. "Independent" (as opposed to Instinctive) dictates their actions when outside the Hive Mind Radius.

>> Squats:
>>
>> What is up with Eldar Antipathy?
>>
The Squat fluff from Games Workshop included it. There has historically been an Elf-Dwarf rivalry (throughout the fantasy genre), and this is keeping with the tradition.

>> Orks:
>>
>> Page 3 - Ork Hordes - Include all the cards, not just boys. For example,
>> when I field the Goffs, I have 1 card of Extra Boyz, 3 Battlewagons, and
>> 1 Dragsta. I have yet to field Lungburstas or anything else for the
>> Goffs
>>
This optional rule is intended to let someone field a huge number of Boyz, but still restrict the number of nifty (and possibly unbalancing in large numbers) units.

>> Page 4 - Like the Extra BW for the Evil Sunz Extra boys. Makes sense!
>>
Thanks.

>> Page 9 - Why are the Nob Warbikes listed as Evil Suns only?
>>
Each clan should have unique units. Yes, other clans could do it, but then you wouldn't have differnt clans - you'd have one ork list with no flavor between clans.

>> Page 10 - I don't understand the delay rules for the Tinbots. Are you
>> saying their orders are random?
>>
No, it just takes a while for the orders to seep into their heads. On turn one you give them orders as normal, and also orders for turn two. On turn two you give them the orders they will follow on turn three, and so on.

>> Page 15 - Supa Rokkit - They should hold 7 stands, not 5.
>>
They held 5 in version 3, five in version 4, and I don't remember discussion to increase this to 7. The Special Card can collectively hold 20 infantry stands, which is enough to carry all the infantry from any basic clan except Goff.

>> Page 17 - Not understanding Clusta Busta - If it uses multiple shots, how
>> come it only uses 1 attack die?
>>
I've edited the description. Now you pick a target and roll 4+ To-Hit at -2 TSM. Then center the barrage template on that target and roll 4+ To-Hit everything at least half underneath, at 0 TSM. Superheavy and larger units are attacked 6 times at 0 TSM.

>> Like the new Mekboy cards. Incorporate the ones I sent to you as well.
>>
Thanks, and you'll have to send 'em to me again - I don't remember receiving Mekboy cards from you.

>> Eldar:
>>
>> Put Dark Eldar in it own section putting their stats on a separate page.
>>
I put their army cards in their own section, then combined all the unit stats for each army book into one table. This was an editorial decision for ease of change.

>> Page 7 - Include the Phoenix Lords Rules I sent you and make sure they
>> can be used by all craftworlds.
>>
Please send 'em to me again and I'll put 'em into the Optional Rules.

>> Page 7 - Typo in the last paragraph of Iyanden - a lone m
>>
Thanks. Should be "many".

>> Page 8 - Let all craftworlds use the Wind Rider Host Give Siam-Hann
>> their original extra bikes.
>>
All craftworlds can use the Jetbike Host, which is two jetbike and one vyper squad at normal cost. Saim-Hann gets the Wind Rider Host, which gives them another jetbike and vyper squad for free.

Given (on the mailing list) both the desire to keep the unit as it is and the intense dislike for such a broken unit existing in the first place, I decided a compromise was to include it but restrict it to the appropriate craftworld. Given the ease with which you can run two craftworlds and get it anyway, it is not a significant restriction.

>> Page 21 - Guardian Storm Squad - What Models should be used? Are these
>> the old Heavy Weapon guys? They are also not listed in the cards section
>>
Yes, they're the old heavy weapon guys. And they're in the Ulthwe list - you'd think that an infantry-heavy craftworld would develop heavy weapons teams.

>> Page 39 - There were no descriptions for Farseers on Jetbikes or Shadow
>> Seers
>>
That's because they're the exact same unit (Farseer) with a different transport. I didn't see the need. Shadowseers don't have the jetbike option.

>> Page 31 - What are Shadow Spinners?
>>
Dark Eldar titan, described in the Dark Eldar unit section.

>> Chaos:
>>
>> I don't like the Animosity Rule. People like us are insane enough to use
>> armies of one Chaos Type, but most Chaos players aren't.
>>
That's why it's an optional rule. If you don't like it, don't use it.

>> Page 21 - Don't forget the description of Chaos Predators.
>>
None of the Space Marine units that Chaos Marines can use are described - go look in the SM book.

>> Page 21 - Can Any Chaos Power use the Hell Talons?
>>
Yes. They're an optional unit, though, so your opponent has to agree it.

>> Page 38-39 - Don't forget the original cards for the Chaos Marine
>> Legions - 3 Detachments of troops
>>
I wanted to give each Legion it's own flavor. As the flavor troops are generally better than the stock troopers I haven't heard any complaints.

>> There was also a unit card in a WD for Jared Slaughter. That should be
>> included too.
>>
I'll put it in the Optional Rules book if you send me a reference.

>> Hope these help. Please let me know when you get this.
>>
Thanks for looking through the books so carefully. We can discuss things on the list over the summer while folks read & playtest, and in August/September we can print up the final 5.0 version. Later!
-Yar



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Received on Mon Jun 13 2005 - 13:32:07 UTC