Re: [Epic] Tactic Critique

From: Scott Shupe <shupes_at_...>
Date: Sat, 26 Jul 1997 16:44:12 -0400

Miller, Chris wrote:
>
> ----> The card suck strategy only works if you stick to it religiously
> right from the start of the game, and it can be a waste, but that tower
> is
> worth some VP's, and if the units inside it die, that's some more.

        One of the biggest shocks I ever got as a chaos player
was facing off against a Space Wolf/Ravenwing/TL army where my
opponent had a reaver group and armed 1 or 2 of them with 2 melta
cannons (25cm, 3+ hits, -4 save mod). He then positioned those
reavers where he thought I'd try to charge him... having never
really seen melta cannons in action before, I got too close...
Lost a Lord of Change to those damn titans (which were surrounded
by grey hunters & wolf guard termies). Just when I was thinking,
"hey, he doesn't have psychics, what do I have to worry about?"

> >> I don't think it was that much faster, either. Maybe a little faster,
> >
> > 30cm compared to 20cm. Plus it was a SHV, so it wasn't
> >likely to get bogged down in CC (not that anyone in their right
> >minds would have assaulted 10 Beasts marching forward).
>
> ----> That SHV was probably it's most important trait. Let's you get
> your riff-raff past the other guys riff-raff. The 30 cm vs 20 cm charge
> didn't impress me that much, but adding on the SHV status does
> help.

        Hey! My Beasts of Nurgle are NOT riff-raff!

        I know 30cm vs 20cm isn't impressive, but it is a
bonus and you don't have to worry about the guys inside
getting shot up on the way in (just have to keep the tower
alive).

> >> I managed ,
> >> once, to have some grey knights teleport down on target to surround
> >> a bloodthirster - "allright, I'm finally gonna kick a 'thirster's
> >> behind in
> >> CC." Then he played the "growth"card.
> >
> > Heh. I love doing that. But then, what were you attacking
> >a Bloodthirster (one of the most useless GDs) with Grey Knights
> >for anyway? GK are really only well-spent trying to kill Magnus
> >or Mortartion.
>
> -----> Well, if you want Khorne troops, you get a bloodthirster, a
> LOB, or Angron.

        LoB! LoB! LoB!!!

        Sorry. I love that thing. Never really does a whole lot,
but I like it anyway. Now if I could only getting around to
painting up that second one...

> I also took
> a bloodthirster a lot, just because the enemy is usually more than

        I used to use the thirster all the time, but then at
some point I realized it never actually KILLED anything. Maybe
a stand or two, but the enemy could usually run away. I still
take one if I need more than 5 khorne minion cards.

> >> I agree doomwings were the best of the Tzeentch engines, but
> >> the Khorne units included numerous shots, some with template
> >> weapons, some which fired blast markers (rare for chaos), some
> >> transport ability, a generally high CAF, and the property of getting
> >> better whenever you were ahead on VP's.
> >
> > And were 3 for 300 points, 3 VPs for killing 2. For
> >killing 2 really big targets with a 2+ armor save. 2 really
> >big targets with (at best) 50cm range weapons, that by
> >definition has to get close to the enemy to do anything. 2
> >really big targets that you can't play chaos cards on, and
> >thus are easily swarmed by bikes. There's no way those guys
> >were even remotely useful.
>
> ----> 50cm range weapons for Chaos are pretty good. How many of
> their things have no shots at all or a piddly 15cm range ?

        Unfortunately, a tank with 50cm weapons is (most likely)
going to get hit but other, longer-ranged tanks before it gets
close enough to use those guns. And most of the khorne engine
weapons were 25cm.

        The engines can be useful if there's heavy cover (lots
of buildings, for instance), but then you're in even more danger
of getting swarmed by bikes/assault troops.

> Marines
> were 50cm too. How many Chaos weapons, other than titan guns,
> get a range over 50cm?

        Well, the marine equipment - Land Raiders, tarantulas,
etc generally has a 50-75cm range. But I learned early on
that Chaos just wasn't meant to shoot. If you get into a
shooting match with the enemy, you're going to lose. When I
started playing, I faced the eldar almost exclusively (yeah,
I lost a lot) and learned to fear those damn eldar lascannons
(75cm, 4+ hits, -2 save mod). Never mind the exarchs, pulsars,
tempests (oy!), etc etc. Eventually I wisened up, stopped
taking more than a few essential tanks/guns, and loaded up on
the daemons, marines, and CC guys. I did a lot better that
way.

> With Chaos, more than any other race, I tend to just take what
> I like. I also happen to like the banelord,

        !!! more useless than the daemon engines, IMHO.

> and the 3 or 4 converted
> warlords
> with the heads & tails, etc. and adding a few titans to the chaos side
> tends to even them up with the other races real quick

        That was fine until TL and everyone else got
battlegroups... at that point I just couldn't see the point
in paying 500 for a reaver when my opponent was only paying
333 points.

> One other thing - have you done much with Chaos in E40K? I
> started Chaos and Eldar in SM/TL, then went mostly Imperial. I spent
> most of the last year or so of it with orks. I haven't tried E40K Chaos
> yet, and no cards would be a major change on the surface. How's
> it working really?

        Still very unexperienced, and still getting used
to the whole 'combined tactics' mindset. Without the cards
it's not quite as fun but I still love the variety of troops
that are available.

        On the whole, I'd have to say that Chaos occupies
basically the same niche it did in SM/TL - kind of a hybrid
close combat/marine army weighted on the close combat side.
The 'nids can still out fight you and the imps & eldar can
still out-shoot you. But the army list is very flexible
(probably the most flexible) and there's a lot you can do
with it. Overall I've been doing OK, but like I said I'm
still in the process of adopting to the new system (this
whole 'maneuvering' concept is still foreign to me =). I
also want to experiment more with the armies (so far I've
tried taking mostly balanced forces), but unfortunately I
don't get to play that often... *sigh*...

Scott
shupes_at_...
Received on Sat Jul 26 1997 - 20:44:12 UTC