Re: [NetEpic ML] More on Ogres (long)

From: Daryl Lonnon <dlonnon_at_...>
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 09:58:44 -0700 (MST)

> I dug up my copy of Ogre miniatures rules, and here are my suggestions to
> the Heathen armylist.
>
> Tread units: These are from miniatures rules and slightly modified to suit
> the Heathen armylist Ogre speeds.
>
> MkI: 16 (each loss of 4 drops max. speed by 5cm)
> MkII: 28 (each loss of 7 drops max. speed by 5cm)
> Ninja: 40 (each loss of 8 drops max. speed by 5cm)
> MkIII, MkIIIb & Fencer: 48 (each loss of 12 drops max. speed by 5cm)
> MkIV: 60 (each loss of 12 drops max. speed by 5cm)
> MkV & Doppelsoldner: 60 (each loss of 15 drops max. speed by 5cm)
> MkVI: 72 (each loss of 18 drops max. speed by 5cm)

Originally, I did do it this way. I then split it up in order to make
it more NetEpic-ish. In general, NetEpic is a little more detailed
than Ogre, so my thought was to add a little more detail to the way Ogres
were damaged. So instead of doing 10 tread points of damage, you
destroy the front right tread.

Honestly, I think your way is easier to track AND makes the Ogre a little
easier to stop (which worried me a little). It also prevents the whole
keep one side facing the enemy, so as to not loose the last of my treads
tactic (which I'd fine a little lame if used against me).

Anybody else want to chime in with a deciding vote (detail versus ease)?
 
> Damage rules for MkI and MkII:
> The smaller Ogres use the optional superheavy damage table modified as
> below. For all results which cause damage (other than damage to track units)
> and do not destroy the Ogre outright place a damage marker beside the Ogre.
> A MkI is destroyed by three damage markers and MkII by four.

Does anything else in NetEpic use a marker?

I kinda like the idea, (since an Ogre can take 3-4 hits before going
bye-bye, making them "Ogre-esque"), but I can't recall anything that
uses them so am afraid it might be a little un-NetEpic-ish.
 
> An attacker may always state that he is aiming at the tracks. In that case
> the damage result is automatically considered to be 1 on the critical damage
> table.

It seems odd that you can pick the tracks to shoot at in the smaller Ogres,
but on the bigger Ogre's you have a chance of missing them and/or hitting
other parts of the Ogre. Maybe you can target the tracks and on a 1-3
it is treated as a 1 on the critical damage table, 4-6 roll on the
regular table -1 (or something similiar).

> 1 - 2: The shot takes out track units equal to the absolute value of the TSM
> + 1.
> 3: Secondary fire control destroyed. The Ogre may only fire half of its AP
> weapon batteries for the rest of the game.
> 4: If MkI, Main battery is destroyed. If MkII, main battery is destroyed on
> 1-3 and both secondary batteries on 4-5.
> 5: Roll on Critical damage table.
> 6: Ammunition storage penetrated! The Ogre is reduced to a crater surrounded
> by debris of various sizes.
>
> Critical damage table
> 1-2: The shot hits a weak spot in track guards and takes out twice the
> amount of track units it normally would.
> 3: Secondary batteries and AP batteries are destroyed. If MkI the result is
> the same as below.
> 4: Primary battery and AP batteries are destroyed.
> 5-6: The shot penetrates the main CPU area, shreds registers and severs
> databuses. From now on roll a d6 at the orders phase of each turn. On 4+ the
> Ogre can move normally. On 1-3 it counts as having no orders (no move and
> may only fire in the advance phase). The Ogre's CAF is halved.

All of this looks good.
 
> Missile racks
> If Ogre has missile racks, it may only fire as many missiles per turn as it
> has missile racks. If all missile racks are destroyed the Ogre may no longer
> fire missiles. However, all missiles save the ones currently inside the
> racks are stored in heavily armored compartments and can't be destroyed. An
> Ogre with unprotected missiles may fire as many of them as the player wishes
> but if the missiles are hit it is more likely a catastrophic damage may
> occur (see below).
>
> Unprotected missile damage table: use the missile rack damage table in the
> Heathen armylist.
>
> Missile rack damage table
> 1-5: One missile rack destroyed, one missile destroyed as well.
> 6: One missile rack destroyed, one missile explodes, center barrage template
> on Ogre and work out as if a missile hit dead center.

I can't recall the missile rack damage table very well. But the above
looks reasonable. What was the issue this was addressing?
 
> OGRE MK I
> Move: 20cm
> Save: 1+
> CAF: +7
> Weapons
> 1 Primary battery (see Heathen list)
> 4 AP batteries (see Heathen list)
>
> OGRE MK IIIb
> As MkIII, but has 4 missiles and 2 primary batteries.
>
> FENCER
> As MkIII, but has 4 missile racks (20 missiles total), 2 secondary batteries
> and no primary batteries.
>
> NINJA
> Ninja is an experimental Ogre made for reconnaissance and infiltration. It
> has the most sophisticated ECM/ECCM and jamming equipment in existence, so
> even though it is as large as a small building all fire attacks against it
> receive an extra -1 to-hit modifier and all direct barrages fired at it must
> roll a scatter die as if fired indirectly.
>
> Move: 25cm
> Save: Damage template
> CAF: +8
> Weapons
> 1 Primary battery (see Heathen list)
> 2 Missile racks (6 missiles total)
> 2 Secondary batteries (see Heathen list)
> 8 AP batteries (see Heathen list)
>
> DOPPELSOLDNER
> Move: 20cm
> Save: Damage template
> CAF: +16
> Weapons
> 2 Primary batteries (see Heathen list)
> 3 Missile racks (20 missiles total)
> 8 Secondary batteries (see Heathen list)
> 12 AP batteries (see Heathen list)
>
> OGRE Mk VI
> Move: 20cm
> Save: Damage template
> CAF: +16
> Weapons
> 3 Primary batteries (see Heathen list)
> 2 Missile racks (20 missiles total)
> 6 Secondary batteries (see Heathen list)
> 16 AP batteries (see Heathen list)

All of the above looks good. (Now we just need some reasonable point
values).
 
> Some flyers and AA vehicles would also be in order, and I would recommend
> adding field repair Ogres.

Yeah, the Ogre rules I have don't specify fliers. AA guns are covered
by the laser batteries (both tower and regular). In the fluff, they
are towed into position and setup around command posts to knock out
ANYTHING that is airborne (which is why GEV's were developed since they
are capable of "hiding" from the laser batteries). Also I added
the special ability of ALL Ogre forces to shoot stuff out of the air
at half their range (if on FF). Built in anti-air systems with every unit.
 
> Opinions? suggestions?

My current thoughts (and I haven't had alot of time to look at them),
are to remove the "Ogre" bonus to armor (so all Ogre slots will
get a +1 to their save areas). This means that Infantry will be
more capable of damaging them. In addition to remove (or make it
very high (7+)) the flashback result in the secondary batteries
damage result to stop lucky infantry shots from taking out an Ogre.

My other thought is to 1/2 their movement rate. The thought here is
that "standard" Ogre movement equates to Advance Orders. But since
Ogre's are command units they get the ability (in NetEpic) to move
at Charge AND Shoot so their movement would need to be halfed in
order to bring them back to the correct speed.

Last but not least, I'm slowly coming to the realization that the
"strength level" of Ogres I want is roughly:
Ogre Mk III == Reaver Titan
Ogre Mk IV == Warlord Titan
Ogre Mk V == a little less than an Imperator Titan
Ogre Mk VI == a little more than an Imperator Titan
I'm not 100% sure about this, however.

Thanx for you comments,
Daryl Lonnon

p.s. Sooner or latter I'm going to run some tests of Ogre's versus
various Titans and/or Imperial Guard units. See how they do and
try to get an idea of what point values they should be given.
 
> Jyrki Saari
Received on Thu Nov 15 2001 - 16:58:44 UTC