> > > This is only one of the things i find strange about some
> > > chaos powers. Like the way some dont discriminate between
> > > good units or lousy ones. The burning bodies card,
> > > for example. Since its a non-physical psychic card,
> > > it doesnt differenciate between units. No matter if
> > > they are 0 CAF infantry with no save which are
> > > a dime a dousin, or Vanguards with 4+ fixed save.
> > > These cards may not be that valuable when playing
> > > against f.ex IG, they are indeed game killers when
> > > played against the Slann. Not to mention that
> > > every time we play chaos, there are A LOT of discussions
> > > about rules and powers. The result is always : "Can
> > > affect any unit" or "Can be played at any time".
> > > I agree its in chaos' nature to be unpredictable,
> > > but if they were this good, they'd have overrun
> > > the universe a long time ago....Who can stand a chance
> > > except those who have units like the astropath?
> >
> > The powers ARE good, that's why so many armies have special anti-chaos
> > units. Slann doesn't get these, but as they are immune to
> > morale checks, I
> > feel this evens out the mightiest chaos power - FEAR!
>
> Well, they are very few in number, so if they were to be
> really affected by fear, they'd be wiped out quite
> easily by chaos. The Slann arent immune to morale tests btw.
I like the fact that at least Necrons are immune, makes me think twice about
some moves. Thought this applied to Slann too...
> > > Our chaos player has also adopted a very good strategy
> > > against us. He simply hides his demons, so that
> > > we cant take any cards away from him, and use
> > > his legions and juggers to attack. VERY effective
> > > in conjunction with some of the awesome "no save, no how"
> > > powers/cards. I've pointed out that a demon would
> > > probably not hide behind buildings, and would certainly
> > > not retreat into the setup zone to hide behind a
> > > building. He certainly agrees to this, but there are
> > > no rules against this, and wont admit that its
> > > cheesy. Its in fact a very sound tactic! Never mind
> > > that the demons behave like cowards :)
> >
> > Hello??? If I can reach CC with my demons, I do! This is
> > where their power
> > is. If you're referring to saturday's game, 3 out of 5 demons charged
> > forward to fight enemy units. Two demons were trapped in the
> > middle with
> > nothing to fight. If they had moved out of cover, you would
> > have had roughly
> > 50 shots to take them out. Why on earth would I do that?
> > Would you use your
> > mages to charge into an area I control? The fact that they're
> > greater demons
> > do not mean that they're stupid...
>
> Im not saying this is a bad tactic, its not, im just saying
> its rather uncharacteristic of chaos. Rather like our discussion
> on whether or not a demon would crouch down in the woods
> to avoid being shot at (since he was standing higher than
> the treetops). After i pointed out that all we had to do
> was buy higher trees (which is silly), we all agreed that
> noone could shoot at anything in the woods unless they were
> inside and very close (and then at a -1).
In my eyes the demons took care of their own parts of the table...
> > > Like the game we played yesterday. Slann/SM vs. Chaos and
> > > Renegade armies. After 2 rounds, Chaos 104? Slann/SM 46 i
> > > think.. Both armies made mistakes, and they had quite
> > > a few lucky dice rolls (like taking out a scout titan
> > > with 3 shots from HW infantry. BUT, its just too good
> > > when they can charge an OP, make the unit invis after CC,
> > > and noone can shoot in. And take out a titan in one
> > > average rolled shot.
> >
> > No, it took Magnus the red two turns to take out the titan.
> > You didn't even
> > use your titan, you just tried to hide it from Magnus. If it
> > is cowardous to
> > hide a demon, how about hiding a titan?
>
> I was quoting statistics, not what actually happened:)
> It seems i should have gotten the 3+ shield save anyways,
> not to mention that i forgot the regen..pff...No more
> late night game sessions :)
Hehe
> I placed the titan on the wrong side. The move i made
> to, as you say "hide" the titan, was made to lure
> magnus the red further out so i could attack him
> with my Conqueror and titan, not just the titan.
> Not a bad move, except that i forgot that demons
> are also skimmers and can pop-up :) Doesnt help
> much to have 2 good units on AF then...
True, but you also forgot to move your Conqueror in turn one... not a
gamewinner...:)
> > > And take over a necron detachment
> > > after the overtakers had moved (no save of course,
> > > why would there be any, they're "chaos powers" after
> > > all), then play a chaos card on that very same detachment
> > > (after CC) and charge 10 more cms to another detachment.
> > > One by one, they're not gamekillers. Together, they
> > > are. With chaos cards, you can always adjust. They're
> > > more than equalizers. Before i played chaos, i saw
> > > the discussions going on on this list, but i never
> > > really took any notice of them. Now i understand what
> > > they were all griping about..
> >
> > You lost on saturday because:
> > 1) You did not field a single barrage weapon against 10K
> > worth of chaos.
> > Hello??? How about using Slann titans with huge templates?
>
> Yes, these cost 1500/2000 points. What part of the battlefield
> would you have like to seen without any units on it?
> Besides, if you can posess a titan which costs this much (you
> will if i roll a 1 or 2), i felt it was a gamble to bring.
In my eyes Eivind could have taken care of one half of the field and you the
other. It wouldn't have been impossible to field a large titan, your mechs
and some necrons... Would have controlled one half quite easily!
> > 2) Eivind held his precious grey knights until round two,
> > only to hide them
> > inside a building. Why did he field them?
>
> I dont know.
>
> > 3) Chaos had a triple backup plans for each single objective
> > on the board.
> > Didn't seem like you had any...
>
> No, we didnt. For one simple reason. We didnt have enough
> units to do this. Thats the major problem with playing
> the Slann (as well it should be).
But SM/Slann in combination should...
> > 4) Nils had some wonderfully lucky rolls...
>
> He sure did...And only on important battles as well.
And one more thing. We had the advantage of being pure chaos as opposed to a
combination...
> > > The good news is that we all agreed the Slann look good
> > > now. We thought the necron titan is overpriced at 750,
> > > but thats just after one game. Against another army,
> > > it might be more balanced. I can certainly understand
> > > why noone wanted to play against the Slann before
> > > they were balanced (except Nils of course, he loves
> > > to be the underdog), i have just the same feeling
> > > against chaos. I cant imagine how its possible to
> > > beat chaos with the orks for example...
> > >
> >
> > We haven't tried that yet... maybee we should??
>
> Yes, well, only if you like winning a sure thing :)
> You could probably beat our "fresh" Ork player with
> half the points...
Depends on what I field. Would be fun to try some of the units that have
just been sitting in my drawer...
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Hellreich [mailto:helreich_at_...]
> > > > Sent: 4. mars 2001 18:19
> > > > To: netepic_at_yahoogroups.com
> > > > Subject: Re: [NetEpic ML] Titan CC
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I do belive you are talking about the Lure of Slannash, and
> > > > yes it is very
> > > > powerful. It does work as such, but I do belive it is not
> > > > auto, as you make
> > > > a Morale check for this if you fail the morale check then the
> > > > enemy may take
> > > > control.
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Karlsen Rune" <rune.karlsen_at_...>
> > > > To: <netepic_at_yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2001 3:25 AM
> > > > Subject: RE: [NetEpic ML] Titan CC
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hi!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Karlsen Rune wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hi!
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Can someone please summarise the rules for how infantry etc.
> > > > > > > attack Titans? It'd be great with a clarification :)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The newest adopted rule playes as follows:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Infantry engged with a titan make a "save" on a roll of 5+.
> > > > > > If the roll
> > > > > > is failed they die and are removed. They play no further part
> > > > > > in close
> > > > > > combat. Vehicles do the same except tehy use their
> > own armor save
> > > > > > instead of the 5+. Survivors fight the titan normally as
> > > > per standard
> > > > > > close combat rules.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > In mixed battles (titans and non-titans engaged in close
> > > > > > combat), treat
> > > > > > each combat separately. This means treat all the non-titan
> > > > > > units engaged
> > > > > > versus the titan as one combat and resolve titan versus
> > > > titan close
> > > > > > combat as another. No bonus d6 are transfered in mixed
> > > > combat's. That
> > > > > > means the combat of non-titans units gives no bonus to the
> > > > > > titan close
> > > > > > combat and viceversa. They are virtuaally independent combats.
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi, thanx for clearing this up :)
> > > > >
> > > > > > > Also, is it possible for chaos to take over
> > robots/necrons with
> > > > > > > their power? Dont remember what its called, but it allows
> > > > > > > it to take over "any unit" within 25cms. When you can put
> > > > > > > the buggers in rhino's and charge 50cms with them in
> > > > > > > the first round, 25cms is alot, and affecting any unit then
> > > > > > > is just downright cheesy. It would mean f.ex, that
> > > > > > > the Necron Titan (which has no shields) could be
> > > > > > > taken over without a save. Now, thats just plain
> > > > > > > old Jarlsberg im smelling! :)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The take over unit power applies to all units regardless
> > > > of what they
> > > > > > are because it controls the "mind" be it organic or CPU,
> > > > it does not
> > > > > > matter. Now having said that, all chaos powers concerning
> > > > > > morale checks
> > > > > > or terror do NOT affect necrons or robotic units, since
> > > > they do not
> > > > > > "fear" in the "organic" sense. The power does allow you to
> > > > > > take ove one
> > > > > > unit, a helpful boon but hardly a game breaker. Besides the
> > > > > > Necron titan
> > > > > > has a psy save of 3+.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > As slann, I have played against chaos. Chaos needs to fight a
> > > > > > different
> > > > > > style battle since many of te standard tactics dont work.
> > > > > > Remember the
> > > > > > magi can nullify psychic powers so it relatively simple
> > > > to eliminate
> > > > > > powers such as this.
> > > > >
> > > > > Simple is a relative word yes. To use the nullify psychic power,
> > > > > you have to bring a Slann mage in a mech, be within 50cms and
> > > > > roll a 3+. AND you cant use a psy power the next turn.
> > > > > Why dont make them need LOS as well, and they'll be really
> > > > > worth taking ;)
> > > > >
> > > > > > > Also, the chaos rot power says it affects all units.
> > > > > > > Were these cards made before Praetorians/Titans came
> > > > > > > into the picture? Once again, you charge your legion
> > > > > > > 50cms, and everything within 15cms of it has to
> > > > > > > save or die when the power is used. Everything!
> > > > > > > Now, in a large battle, say 10k, this will be devastating.
> > > > > > > Im sure the rot is really the reek of really old, moldy
> > > > cheese ;)
> > > > > > > Id like some clarifications on the chaos powers, and
> > > > > > > what they can and cant do please :)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > First, the rot power affects anything because its "magical"
> > > > > > rot, so even
> > > > > > vehicles and titans. Second titan with shields of
> > > > psy-saves get thier
> > > > > > saves. Third, the unit gets its armor save which in case of
> > > > > > titans/preatorians is always a 1+, thus rendering them
> > > > immune to this
> > > > > > power. (assuming their location template has a 1+ armor save
> > > > > > somewhere,
> > > > > > but most titans except the smaller ones have that, even then
> > > > > > it affects
> > > > > > only a single location, that of the best save). I use
> > mortarion
> > > > > > regularly, belive me, its an infantry killer, but is very
> > > > > > poor against
> > > > > > any unit with a decent save.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Peter
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
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Received on Mon Mar 05 2001 - 11:35:39 UTC