[Epic] Re:

From: Aaron P Teske <Mithramuse+_at_...>
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 1997 15:30:02 -0500 (EST)

Excerpts from Epic: 16-Jan-97 by Brett Hollindale_at_powerup
> Hmmm.
> There seem to be quite a few consciencious objectors to the premise that
> Squat Super Heavies (and Colossi in particular) cheese all over the humble
> Imperial Reaver Titan.

Ye'd be correct.

> It would be fair to say that if there is no defence against a warp or vortex
> missile then the Reavers are most definitely better value for money. If,
> however, you get a void shield saving throw (as I am pretty sure you do)
> then two Colossi should take down three Reavers while losing only one of
> their number.

And I'm just as sure you don't. While the Warp missile vs. void shield
arguement is something of an "immoveable object vs. unstoppable force"
arguement, there are a few things in favor of the side that Warp
missiles ignore void shields:

1) The Q&A page:

---cut here---
Q: If a Warp missile is fired at a Squat super Heavy does it still
bypass the shields and auto destroy the super heavy on a 3+?

A: Yes.
---cut here---

The answer seems clear enough. ^_^ Since Squat void shields are the
same as Imperial void shields, one can also assume that Warp missiles
bypass all such, though that isn't relevant to the discussion.

2) Psychic attacks vs. Warp Energy attacks. Reference page 24 of the TL
rulebook. Here, "Shields" and "Psychic Saves" are in two seperate
sections, therefore having void shields is not necessarily the same as
having a psychic save. (Though you've obviously drawn the conclusion
that it is.) Looking down at the last section, Warp & Vortex Missiles
use "Warp Energy", they are *not* psychic attacks. Looking back at the
"shields" section, void shields only give the 4+ save against *psychic*
attacks, *not* warp energy attacks. I believe Mark Shieh tried to point
this out earlier.

Note that the psychic save of void shields has been around since the
second edition box, it was just never stated in the shields section.
Instead, it was stated in the description of the various powers; see,
for example, the Eldar Warlock entry, where it states that the powers
don't work half the time if the target has void shields. Since no
similar statement is made for Warp Missiles, one can (IMO) assume that
Warp Missiles always pass through void shields.

3) Historical use. While not totally relevant to the current edition,
there have been indications lately that there are things in TL that are
assumed, and not stated in the rulebook, i.e. a roll of '1' always
misses, and CC weapons for Titans may only be mounted on the arms. (See
Allen's Q&A.) These answers from the Primarchs are consistant with
Adeptus Titanicus, so here's what AT has to say about Warp missiles:

---cut here---
A Warp Missile actually travels through Warpspace, the strange chaotic
universe used by starships to span immense distances in space. The
missile enters Warpspace when it is fired, and is programmed to re-enter
normal space on the other side of the target's Void Shields. It may
sometimes materialize inside the target itself.

Ignore any modifiers for cover when rolling to hit. If a Warp Missile
misses, do not roll for deviation. A miss indicates that the missile
has left Warpspace at the wrong point, and that could be anywhere in any
of a million universes....

When a Warp Missile hits, it ignores any Void Shields the target may
have, and automatically causes damage. Roll on the following
table....<snipped for brevity>
---cut here---

Now, I'll admit that some things have changed (Warp Missiles no longer
ignore cover, but then you don't find Titans under cover much; they also
now hit Titans automatically, though they scatter twice so they don't
*automatically* hit) but the basic premise remains the same. Warp
Missiles ignore void shields.

Now, as for Vortex Missiles:

1) The Q&A:
---cut here---
Q: Are Vortex Missile's carapace only, like the other one-shots? If so,
do they still have the FF only limit? How much of a model needs to be
covered to be affected? What happens if a titan has operating void
shields when it is hit?

A: Carapace only/FF limit applies/50%/all void or power shields are
knocked down.
---cut here---

The "all void & power fields knocked down," incidentally, is again
totally consistant with what is stated in Adeptus Titanicus, though I'm
a bit annoyed with the Primarchs on this one since there it isn't very
clear in the TL rulebook that this happens -- only that whatever it hit
automatically suffers damage if it's a Titan or building, or is sucked
into the vortex & automatically destroyed if it's not. (IMO, Squat
Chassis SHVs would actually be too large to be sucked in, since they
*shuold* be larger than scout Titans, but that's probably just me.
Making that ruling would mean Vortex Missiles become particularly
*un*effective against the Chassis vehicles....)

2) See point two for Warp missiles; again, Vortex missiles are warp
energy attacks, not psy attacks. Therefore no void shield save.

3) Historical. As stated in no.1; I can reprint the section if you're

> It would be a long and tedious post to explain in detail why this will
> happen, and so I won't waste my time and yours unless soomeone realy, realy
> wants to read it...

Yo! (And I might just do some practice runs of my own, given a little
                    Aaron Teske
                    Squat Leader, Den'Len Fetch
Received on Thu Jan 16 1997 - 20:30:02 UTC

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