RE: [Epic] Uncheesy detachments

From: Miller, Chris <CMiller_at_...>
Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 16:54:43 -0600

> >
> > You _couldn't_ cheese out an army solely through composition in
> SM/TL
> > precisely because of something people seem to loathe - the army
> cards.
>
> Who loathes army cards? I've never heard anyone ever
> complain about them in the past...
>
---------> I remember quite a few posts early on when E40K came out
where people did nothing but dis the cards. Hasn't come up recently, but
a lot of those people are gone or at least calmed down...
(I thought you were one of the holdouts and thought SM/TL was better
etc.?)

> > For most armies, the 1 special card per company card and max of 5
> > support cards per company card with prechosen unit sizes on each
> card
> > prevented a cheese-out. Now some of the actual units were
> overpowered or
> > underpowered for the cost, but the cards limited the quantity of
> these
>
> Hooey. Specials were somewhat limited, but I've never
> seen anyone have problems with running out of support slots.
> You want tons of 50pt Thawks? No prob. A couple of batteries
> of barrage missile deathstrikes? Go ahead! Cheesy armies are
> definitely possible in SM/TL unless the players decide to limit
> themselves (Agro's Rule of Three is a good start).
>
        -------> That's what I really hate about Scott's posts - it's so
hard to tell what he's thinking...pick a side,man!!!
        : )
           The T-hawks can be a problem, but I haven't noticed an
extreme durability on their part in the post-TL environment. They
usually get that first turn's move then BAM! You also still have to buy
a company card to enable their purchase, which can inflate their cost a
bit by increasing the minimum investment to get them.
            The deathstrikes are a bigger problem IMO, as one T-hawk
move usually won't win the game but one good roll with a barrage missile
certainly can. We just never had anyone take extreme amounts of these,
but yeah, adding 5 to an IG arty co would be obscene. Unless of course,
as the opponent you take those 5 T-hawks...
                Again I'd say every army had some kind of cheesy
arrangement it could take advantage of. There's the two above, and even
with orks, you could have the KOS take 5 batteries of Pulsa rokkits and
use Mega-gargants as the core of unbreakable hordes of nobz & boyz.
Chaos could take those cheesy T-hawks _and_ have specially-powered chaos
marines jump out of them. Eldar had probaly the least cheese
structurally (are 10 doomweavers cheesy?) but had enough special crap
otherwise that they shouldn't feel too left out...
           BUT - under E40K I can take 10 Thawks as a seperate unit,
Deathstrikes too. Abuses were possible under the old system (OK), but
here I just didn't see them as much. Maybe it was the way things were
grouped - I really think having to buy a company card controlled a lot
of this abuse as if I had a spare 300 points I couldn't just add in 5
more deathstrikes - I had to find a slot for them and buy them in groups
of 3. I tended to see (roughly) 1 company + support per 1000 points
(though admittedly the more points you had the less certain this was).
You had a second constraint beyond simple points value which meant units
like T-hawks, though cheap in points, were "expensive" in terms of
slots, and you could find yourself in the interesting position of having
a lot of points and not too many slots left.
> I don't suppose anyone held onto the Great Mailing List
> Battle between the all-THawk Chaos army and the 'Nids?
>
--------> An illustrative and enlightening cheese-fest no doubt...

> > I like the flexibilty of the new
> > system but it's certainly open to abuse.
>
> As was the old system.
>
--------> Still don't think it's as "twistable" as the old one...

Chris Miller
Received on Fri Feb 06 1998 - 22:54:43 UTC