Hi,
There are several considerations when creating a new NetEpic army list.
Wheter it is building one from scratch or translating one from WH40K.
First and foremost it is important to create a playable and balanced
army, secondly it should be an army with a distinct design i.e. Squats
are sturdy and shooty, eldar are swift and specialized but few and
fragile, IG are numerous but slow etc.
I beliewe I was the first list member to translate the TAU to NetEpic,
and one of the contributors to the current list. One of the main
challenges when translating a W40k list to NetEpic is that you need to
scale the army for larger conflicts. In the case of the TAU we where
quite lucky because the fluff had a description of the Mantis Cruiser. A
flyer/floater/skimmer preatorian. This was something completely new, and
added to the uniqueness of the army design. However that was IMO not
enough heavy equipment to make the TAU list robust enough to function as
a standalone NetEpic army. Thus I introduced the Killer Whale super
heavy tanks (Basically it is a Tempest). A unit I feel would work
excelent alongside the other units translated from GW and add overall
strenght to the Tau NetEpic army. Since that initial suggestion the TAU
army has grown and now the discussion is wether or not to include TAU
titans.
I would advocate that we do not add titans to the Army list. IMHO they
are not needed to balance the army. We have kept very close to the
original fluff thus far, and this would be a sidetrack to the current
developement route for this specific list. However, my main argument is
that it just dosen't feel right. It removes the uniqueness from the TAU,
and makes it just another armylist. I think we should rater cultivate
the difrences and try to make each and every army stand out from the
others in as many ways as possible. Yet striving to make things as
balanced as possible.
So if I could give a suggestion on what I would like to see happen with
the TAU is to give the race the same victory point conditions as the
Tyrranids. This is based on the GW fluff, where TAU don't fight a battle
to gain land, but rather viewe the whole affair as a grand hunt.
Opinions?
Just my 2 kroner
Nils
-----Original Message-----
From: Toma Diener [mailto:peyoterattle_at_...]
Sent: 14. april 2005 11:41
To: netepic_at_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [NetEpic ML] Re: Tau Titans
--- In netepic_at_yahoogroups.com, Morgan_Keyes_at_c... wrote:
> You know, I half suspected this would happen, and that the original
>intent of my post >would be lost or muddled by others. Frankly, I
>care one whit whether anyone on here >loves or hates GW and FW. I
>don't have a position on them one way or another and >never said
>otherwise. People on here bemoaned a lack of Praetorian/Titan-level
>unit in >the Tau. I presented an alternate line of thought beyond
>"must be a Titan", not because I >didn't agree with Tau
>Knights/Titans, but just to present a different approach.
Morgan, where is this coming from?
The Spirit of NetEpic is open debate, and the reading of your text as
written ....well: it seems quite Harsh based on the one remaining
strong dissenting opinion from yours (Mr. Dean).
> This was followed by "no, no...can't do that cause there are no
>models for these >concepts"
Allow me to re-iterate my position, with added emphasis:
-------> Point Taken! <-------
------->We (the group of NetEpic players) don't want to end up being
like Star Fleet Battles in regard the the Star Trek Franchise: so far
removed from the General Population's conception of accepted 'Canon'
that we become marginialized and inaccesible.
------>We should _definitely_ do approprite Stat Lines for any and
all ForgeWorld Tau Praetorians on the market. ...Even potential ones
only on the Scedule right now...
Morgan: the majority of people Agree with you on this point!
The "dissenters" simply don't want tp be limited by ForgeWorld's
perceived flaws
(1)delays in Production of new units
2) extreme fragility of Resin and
3) excesive cost
As to your counter-point:
We _absolutely_ do " have alot of readily available models for
alot of NetEpic units".
Every Unit in NetEpic has an existing Model, and these models are
ubiquitous on EBay
(2 cases in Point:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5184846717&rd=1&sspag
ename=STRK%3AMEBI%3AIT&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5184845507&rd=1&sspag
ename=STRK%3AMEBI%3AIT&rd=1
I myself have found 3 of each of these models in 3 months, at
reasonable prices (in fact: watch these auctions: The opening bids of
under $10- are likely to escalate to the market value of about $85-,
perhaps a little more since I am drawing attention to them. My point
is these ?extremely Rare and Hard to find Desiderata?s end up
costing.....about as much as Forge World pieces currently are).
> Not that really cared, but for the sake of giving the group
>information I said that there were models for some out there.
It would appear, based on your reaction, that of -course- you care,
and that is understandable: If this wasn't interesting (read
'important') to us all as a group, well: ...there are lots of Yahoo
groups.
We are all here because this is supposed to be Fun and Interesting.
I personally did not know about the Forge World models: I knew
the BFG ships existed, because I have a friend who owns them. Thus,
your information was both timely and Helpful.
Thank You!
Your information in fact caused me personally to 180' on the Idea. I
re-iterate for emphasis:
"Point Taken! We don't want to end up being like Star Fleet
Battles: so far removed from the General Populations conception of
accepted 'Canon' that we become marginialized. We should definitely do
approprite Stat Lines for any and all ForgeWorld Tau Praetorians on
the market. Even potential ones....
>Again, I don't care if some think they are expensive and/or they
don't like the makers. >That's moot.
It is not Moot. It is a point to consider. Is it the -only- Point?
of course not!
But it is most assuredly not moot!
> Frankly I'm rather disappointed with the apparent knee-jerk that
>leads the point of the >original discussion to be lost. Fine,
>continue your discussions. I'd hate to detract because >a line of
>thought that gets presented gets misread via logic Cheetah Flips as
>some >GW/FW cheerleading or runs counter "party line".
I think you are being a bit unfair with the "Cheetoh Logic Flip"
comment...
The one person who is apparently the direct object of your derision
(Brian) made two valid points for consideration. I quote:
?> > it is only a model replacement.
> > Yes, the tau look beautiful but,, they are resin, (light as a
> > feather and brittle) and more pricy than i could ever hope to >
> >afford on my salery and lifestyle. ?
Are these the only considerations? No, of course not.!
Are they ""Cheetoh Logic Flip"s? I personally don't see them as so.
Rather, they (the price and delicacy of Forge World models) are
added impetus to create an expanded, or perhaps supplementary
"alternate" Tau force composition based on general Tau principles
(Anime Mecha style warriors) that would be cheap, durable, and easy to
build up to NetEpic levels.
No one is suggesting to _not_ look at existing Tau Forgeworld models
(( as far as I can determine: the closest to that I can find in the
thread is Peter's suggestion that we not create units based on EA
_stat lines_ alone, but rather wait until such models actually
materialize...and my own post {?$6,500?} which was in fact a joking
and playful rejuinder: I own that it could be misinterpreted,
especially if one didn?t read my follow-up for the Punch-Line. For
this: I Apologize!!!)
The only real point under real debate (ASAIK) is :
"How do we design a Tau army which would be useable by the General
NetEpic player"?
The Main Points to consider so far as I see them :
1) NetEpic is a game of Mass Combat, whereas E:A is almost (if not
actually) a skirmish level system. A large E:A force (based on what I
have seen being played) would be about 1K points in NetEpic (your
observations may vary). GW?s current Pricing reflects this: EA
armies are smaller than some of my existing 40K armies! (OK, I?m an
extreme example, but it?s still a valid point).
2) availability of new units : release sgchedules (E:3rd ed....need I
say more?)
3) GW Canon : It exists: we should use it.
4) extreme fragility and excesive cost of Resin : its a problem.
Any other real substantial points.....?
ReB T'oma
Head Designer, Wabi-Sabi Games
Lyrics are Here:
http://sheridan.gothcentric.com/lyrics/sinisterducks.php
Animated Video is Here:
http://pip.rubberfeet.org/stuff/ducks.html
and.............No Brian: _You_ call them ?ThunderBirds? ......(are
GO!)
I prefer to use our original Title: one word:
__?Thunder-Cougar-Falcon-Bird?__ !!!!!!
> > Actually in my current gaming group with T'oma, we use Eldar bfg
> > cruisers to emulate the vampire troop carrir, and since we think
> > that the vampire was named wrongly,
Because ?Vampire? is clearly a Dark Eldar vehicle name, dig?
>>we have called it the
> > thunderbird, more fitting to us,,, its our idea's and house rule but
To unsubscribe send e-mail to: netepic-unsubscribe_at_egroups.com
Yahoo! Groups Links
Received on Thu Apr 14 2005 - 13:46:00 UTC