Hi Peter!
I am seeking the wording in both game systems, NetEpic and Games
Workshop. The wording was not changed in Titan Legions (I Think,
check me, I might be wrong,) and was released in the Original Space
Marine set. So they had plenty of time to alter the rules, if they
wanted to. They did alter the cost of Striking Scorpians, and some
other things, when the 2nd set of cards came out. Warlocks cards
have not been altered one bit since the 1st set of cards came out.
My feeling is that everyone has thier own way of handling this based
on tradition and hearsay. NetEpic, and your flyer rules have favored
aircraft, and made them more like thier modern day counterparts.
Hence, the off board flyer morement of NetEpic yore. Flyers, in your
wiew, are very hard to hit.
Psycic powers upset your Flyer Rules. If you can hold that sceaming
aircraft on the table, instead of letting it move away, you can
easily target it. This would be devestating to your notion of how a
Flyer Rules system should be. If I liked to have hard to hit, fast
flyers, and really believed that was the best way to go, I would
probably interpret the Psychic Rules as you do now.
But I don't... I see aircraft more in the Games Workshop way, with
high and low elevation, and much, much easier to shoot down
aircraft. The Psychic Powers under the old Games Workshop rules, if
you used them as I do, were not that great a danger against aircraft.
Aircraft were easily targeted by a great number of more mundane
weapons. So you hold the T-Hawk, and make it motionless. Dosn't
really matter too much, you could target the T-Hawk with your guns,
without penalty, (or a small penalty), anyway!
Maybe I'm off the mark on this, I certainly don't want to put words
in your mouth, but this is my perception.
Thanks for the info on the imobilized unit CAF, that's good stuff to
know. As is ALL you info, even if I have a different point of view!
Thanks Peter!
Warprat ;)
--- In netepic_at_egroups.com, "Peter Ramos" <primarch_at_b...> wrote:
> Hi!
>
> The wording is okay IF you remember the power was there before
flyers were
> introduced to the game. You will find it hard to find hard and fast
> interpretations from GW because we all know their bad habit of
introducing
> rules to the game without thought of the effects on already
existent rules
> and units.
>
> That's why in net epic we have made those things clearer, since GW
never
> did. Anytime you find this problem, that's the usual reason, old
rules
> weren't taken into account for new rules and units.
>
> As for immobilized units the rule is one only: "immobilized units
lose their
> CAF bonus, they only roll the basic 2d6". That's for all units in
the game.
>
> By the way Dave are you seeking the wording in the original game
rules or in
> net epic. If its an omission let me know, I'm not clear on what
source you
> are referring to.
>
> Regarding flier, one of the reasons that flyers are now sort of an
optional
> thing overall speaks to what you point out regarding disagreements
between
> players. That's why we left something very bare bones as core and
let people
> sort out their house rules.
>
> Peter
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dave [mailto:warprat_at_j...]
> Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2000 5:05 PM
> To: netepic_at_egroups.com
> Subject: [NetEpic ML] Re: Eldar Warlock Powers
>
>
> Hi Questor!
>
> Well, I guess we just won't be able to agree on this. And that's
OK.
> I WOULD like to see that Q and A from GW, so I know where GW is
> comming from on this.
>
> If you are right, the wording on the power is extreamly poor.
Saying
> nothing about Flyers being excluded, and nothing in the pschic
rules,
> (at least that I could find). Please find a rule, if you can, I
hate
> these kind of discrepancies.
>
> As far as targeting a piece of ground, I see no support for that
idea.
> Nothing against it, but nothing for it either.
>
> It isn't an auto kill, because beyond immobilizing the target, it
> does nothing else. It could make the flyer more easy to target,
> however. With the original GW Flyer rules, targeting flyers was
much
> easier. So the Warlock power Psychic Lock was not very devestating
> to flyers, compared to NetEpic. NetEpic has made flyers much harder
> to kill. I know that my group and others are using House Rules for
> flyers, because it's a big point of disagreement.
>
>
> Warprat ;)
>
>
>
>
> --- In netepic_at_egroups.com, quester <quester666_at_y...> wrote:
> >
> > ok think about it this way the lock is not put in place at the
> speed of thought it takes time to manafest so to say
> >
> > and it is a blast effect weapon attack and as per game rules they
> can t target flyers This is the big reason you can use it on flyers
> and if you use it on a flyer it would be a auto kill with no dice
> rolling making it way to powerful Its not writen to be a killing
> power
> >
> > The warlock is not targeting a unit but a spot of ground with a
> time lock effect that blasts out from that point stoping time in
the
> blast
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Dave <warprat_at_j...> wrote:
> > Hi Hellreich!
> >
> > How fast does a unit have to go, to not be targeted? Mind powers
> > operate at the speed of thought. True, some take form in energy
> and
> > matter, but even those can be Snap fired. Non-physical powers
> should
> > be even faster, because there is no travel time in physical space.
> > The unit thinks it, and it happens. And in the case of Pschic
> Lock,
> > it keeps on happening, as long as the Warlock concentrates, or the
> > model breaks free. Since the Warlock can hold a Titan, it's
> basicly
> > a matter of concentration on the Warlocks part.
> >
> > Also, think about this. A plane is in the air and probably
visable
> > the entire turn. A bike can be behind cover, only visible for the
> > last 2cm. Yet, only the bike could be targeted? Reaction wise,
> the
> > plane should be an easier target.
> >
> > Is the Warlock ONLY using his power once per turn, like a spell
> being
> > cast after a lenghthy incantation? Or is the Warlock like most
> other
> > units, firing and targeting through the whole turn? In game
terms,
> > we give each unit a roll of the die, a chance to affect one thing.
> > But in real life, targeting and fire is more of a constant stream,
> > than ONE big burst. The Psycic lock can last entire turns.
> >
> > I view the Warlock power Psychic Lock, similar to the Babylon 5
> > psycic power, used to hold Shadow ships. They had to be able to
> see
> > the enemy ships with thier own eyes, yet the enemy moved very,
> very,
> > fast.
> >
> > Warprat ;)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In netepic_at_egroups.com, "Hellreich" <hellreich_at_n...> wrote:
> > > sure bikes and titans are slower then planes. Think about it, a
> > bike top
> > > speed 200mph, Ever ride one that fast? Just trying to hold on is
> > hard enough
> > > at 167mph, I know I'm nuts and onw one hehehehe :-) GSXR750.
> Plane
> > single
> > > prop, this thing has to reach 100mph just to take off. A jet
> mach1 -
> > to
> > > faster than sound. Pretty hard to target something that fast. If
> > the plane
> > > just stopped it would crash to the ground. The warlock has to
> have
> > time
> > > enough to effect the model the plane would have been there and
> gone.
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Dave " <warprat_at_j...>
> > > To: <netepic_at_egroups.com>
> > > Sent: Friday, December 15, 2000 6:40 PM
> > > Subject: [NetEpic ML] Re: Eldar Warlock Powers
> > >
> > >
> > > > Hi Peter, Quester, and all!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I'm going to put a set of Flyer House Rules together for my
> > playing
> > > > group. It will be mostly based on the "Old GW Rules", with
some
> > > > additions from Peters and Nils Flyer Rules.
> > > >
> > > > I used some Warlocks on some T-Hawks last game. Looks like I
> > made a
> > > > mistake, but you couldn't tell just by reading the rules. The
> > rules
> > > > say ANY model, and Psychic powers are capable of being Snap
> Fired.
> > > >
> > > > I sure would like to see that Games Workshop Q and A's,
because
> I
> > > > viewed the Warlock Power as something that was more
sustainable,
> > > > being as how it could last from turn to turn. The power can
> hold
> > > > Titans, so it's also strong. Many bikes are almost as fast
as a
> > > > flyer, faster if you use a Chaos Card. But yet, bikes can be
> > held,
> > > > and flyers can't.
> > > >
> > > > Hmmmm, this still doesn't make sense to me. Warlocks and
other
> > > > Psychers are usually a Special Card, so it doesn't seem a play
> > > > ballance issue.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Why this rule, anyone have any opinions?
> > > >
> > > > Warprat ;)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > To unsubscribe send e-mail to: netepic-unsubscribe_at_egroups.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
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Received on Sun Dec 17 2000 - 02:20:31 UTC