Re: [NetEpic ML] unballanced armies

From: Peter Ramos <primarch_at_...>
Date: Tue, 29 May 2001 21:36:33 -0400

Hi!

I'm always for new units, I need some more before the new units book is
to be made. Are you aware the recent squat book includes tunnelers and
squat specific tanks and transports?

If possible try to recommend a suitable model for any new units you make
so as to make it easy for others to field them.

Anxious to hear some ideas on this.

Peter

Albert Farr� Benet wrote:

> Well, I agree that squats are difficult to beat, but it depends on the
> ability of your opponent (and yours, of course). I think that Squats
> are the easiest army to play. Anyone can take Squats and sit down,
> start to fire and wipe out anything that comes out of the smoking craters.
>
>
>
> But you'll find that playing squats this way you'll win some (lots
> of) games UNTIL some one beats you. Then you'll start losing because
> your tactic is worn out and your gaming group has found the spoiler
> for the basic squat tactics. And then you'll have lots of problems to
> surprise your opponent with a new tactic, because squats are not Eldar
> nor SM. Squat army is a very unflexible one, even less than IG,
> because IG at least has a wider choice of different units to
> allow different possibilities of approaching each game.
>
>
>
> I also agree with Peter, Squats are the opposite of Chaos, if you
> survived 3 turns against squats, this means you'll have much chances
> to win.
>
>
>
> And now for somehing completely different: the squat army
>
>
>
> Would it be possible to add more squat units? I find their army list
> too undeveloped. I know this is not a problem from Netepic, because GW
> has never developed squats to their full capability (has he ever
> developed them beyond the basic game first approach?).
>
>
>
> I think squats should have something as scouts, or learning warriors
> or some kind of cheaper troop with less morale. It can't be that ALL
> squats are amazing warriors...they had to spent some time learning,
> and in times of war every citizen is needed to fight.
>
> And what about some infantry variants, like support squats with
> flamers or medium range heavy weapons (like Heavy Bolters - 2 dice 50
> cm -1 ST)
>
>
>
> I also think we could add some specific squat tunnellers. They live
> underground, don't they? so they should have better technology than IG.
>
>
>
> New ideas always welcomed of course, but please, don't make squats
> still more static; no more artillery pleaze!
>
>
>
> I would like to hear some opinions on that, perhaps even a poll (oh my
> god, heretic! heretic! cleanse'im!) wether squats could be developed a
> little further.
>
>
>
> Albert
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From:nils.saugen_at_... <mailto:nils.saugen_at_...>
>
> To:netepic_at_yahoogroups.com <mailto:netepic_at_yahoogroups.com>
>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 9:56 AM
>
> Subject: RE: [NetEpic ML] unballanced armies
>
>
> I have to agree, I played sqats with my Necrons (3.0 rules if I
> remnember
> correctly) and barely won. I played one of IMHO best games ever,
> and my
> opponend did some strange things.( I won because he chose not to
> attack a VP
> on the flank with his bikes, thus making it possible for me to
> move my mechs
> up close to them and blast away with my heavy weaponry, + I made
> that all
> crutial repair roll on a unit holding a objective on a bridge in
> the centre
> of the field). I have said it for a while, I guess both Rune and
> Trygve can
> confirme this, squats are very hard to defeat perhaps too
> difficult. Now
> that is just a challenge for me, I love playing against armies
> with superior
> stats. However, I understand perfectly well why some groups might
> ban squats
> from the game ruling them as an unbalanced army. (They are
> certainly very
> close)
>
> Nils
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Karlsen Rune [mailto:rune.karlsen_at_...]
> Sent: 29. mai 2001 09:25
> To: 'netepic_at_yahoogroups.com'
> Subject: RE: [NetEpic ML] unballanced armies
>
>
> Yes, we've tried Slann Vs. Squats. I brought the firepower i
> could, and my
> best CC troops, but i still lost pretty had. A company of Medium mechs
> and a necron titan just doens't compare with two Leviathans (or was it
> Colossuses?),
> neither in price or killing power. If Slann want to take heavy
> support equal
> to two
> Leviathans, they have to bring out the big Titans, and fielding
> one of these
> in a 3-4k battle is just ludicrous. Besides, any of the Slann
> titans can be
> taken out in one lucky shot (this
> is true for all titans, but Slann titans are even more vulnerable
> to this).
> Squats are even harder to beat than chaos imho, mostly due to
> their high
> BP's and cheap Praetorians.
>
> Rune
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Albert Farr� Benet [mailto:cibernyam_at_...]
> Sent: 29. mai 2001 02:00
> To: netepic_at_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [NetEpic ML] unballanced armies
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I don't understand why you keep saying squats have a bad CAF.
>
> Besides from SM, which non-CC-focused army (this is, all but Nids
> and Chaos)
> fields troops with a minimum CAF of +2 (remember the "1" reroll
> gives Squats
> an equivalent of almost +2 extra CAF)?.
>
> Eldar? no, they have very low numbers with good CAF.
> IG? absolutely no, their assault troops have +1 CAF (and remember
> chain of
> command and bad morale).
> Orks? their best CC troops are +3 while you reroll "1" and "2" (
> equivalent
> to +3/+4 CAF).
> Slann? Yip, they have a little better CAF but you fight them on equal
> numbers. Your superior firepower should balance that.
> PDF and SOB? Don't make me laugh, PDF couldn't win a CC fight even
> against a
> tree... and sisters of battle are ajust a little better than PDF.
>
> If you try to beat Nids and Chaos in CC with Squats (or any other
> army) then
> I can't say nothing, because I can't imagine how (Don't tell me
> with big
> numbers, because big numbers means big morale disadvantatges, and
> playing
> against Chaos in CC bad morale means losing CC even before starting).
>
> Even so, a good Squat player will try to shatter the opponent's
> army to
> pieces before CC to equal numbers, or obviously will lose due to
> overwhelming numbers.
>
> I'm just talking of infantry, but I really hate bikers when
> playing against
> Squats. My figures point that for every squat biker I loose about
> 1,5 SM
> bikes in CC; just compare the break points and you'll see that
> Bikers are
> really tough (but not invincible, for sure).
>
> Anyone disagrees?
>
>
> P.S. Anyone tried Squats vs Slann? I think it will be very
> interesting,
> could show the tactics ability of commanders trying to make
> maximum use of
> very few units. Kinda empty field, isn't it?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Sam <mailto:epic_at_...> Dale
> To: netepic_at_yahoogroups.com <mailto:netepic_at_yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, May 28, 2001 9:25 PM
> Subject: Re: [NetEpic ML] unballanced armies
>
>
> > They have no infantry with good CAF. +2 at most, they have some
> +6 but
> only one pr detachment, so almost every army can beat you in CC.
> If you want
> to beat your opponent in CC you have to swarm him, which leads to
> my other
> point.
>
> Ummmm. Bikers with +4 CAF and a move of 30cm... Yeah, you can't storm
> buildings, but that's what the mass of artillery and the berserkers in
> rhinos are there to deal with.
>
> > Few in numbers. This might sound odd as the companies are quite
> large. But
> because of the low CAF you have to committ at least 2/3 of a
> company to gain
> controll of an OP. As the companies are quite expencive I never
> controll
> more than 3 in a 3k game.
>
> I had 4 companies, 1 support and 1 special in 3k. I was
> outnumbered by the
> marines, but outgunned and outfought them to a terrifying degree.
>
> > Bad movability.
>
> Bikes, trikes, gyrocopters. And the Overlords just keep going.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Sammy Chaos. Barprop of Slaanesh and Bane of the Organised.
>
>
>
>
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Received on Wed May 30 2001 - 01:36:33 UTC

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