Re: [Epic] Rants. Was SM/TL vs E40K unit costs

From: Sean Smith <seans_at_...>
Date: Sun, 8 Mar 1998 08:39:44 +1300 (BST)

On Sat 07 Mar, Alan E & Carmel J Brain wrote:
> chadtaylor wrote:
> > > Good to have you back, Sir! There's still some talk by people about our
> > > - er - Epic Thundercheese vs Tyrannid battle we had a while ago.
> >
> > Great, I'm famous in defeat :)
> Actually, I conceded you a moral victory: it was my contention that even
> a greatly inferior general could win vs anything with 20 Thunderhawks
> with Chaos Space Marines. You out-generalled me and gave me so many
> problems that if I hadn't of been scathingly brilliant (cough cough),
> you would have won.
> > >
> > > BTW did you get those 10+ boxes of Epic Figs I sent you about 12 months
> > > ago? If not, then even by Australia Post standards, they're overdue...
> > Nope, never saw them.
> AGH. That's 14 boxes, 5 sprues each, or the equivalent of US $350 these
> days. How utterly tiresome. I'll have to go through my old e-mail and
> find out exactly when I posted 'em, to what address etc. But I suspect
> they're Gorn without trace. Quelle Bummer.
> Still, to have you back on the list is more than adequate consolation.
> > So, did you make the change to E40k or are you still holding back? What
> > about the other 'old guys' from way back when? I notice the list seems to
> > be split, rather heated at times it seems also.
> After some trepidation, I tried E40K. Although there are a few wrinkles
> that need smoothing out, and too much flavour has been removed, I
> consider E40K to be the best set of miniatures rules that GW have ever
> produced. The units are (slightly over-)simplified, but the game
> mechanics are simple but rich. More complex than SM2/TL, which had very
> simple basic rules but a zillion exceptions and special rules added.
> NetEpic, last time I looked, appeared to have made a better but more
> complex set of basic rules, and a more consistent but still more complex
> set of exceptions for special units. Like SFB, it's become too complex
> for my taste, but YMMV.
> I've certainly enjoyed playing E40K more than SM2, but like SM2
> nonetheless. The only complaint I have about E40K is that some of the
> simplifications were over-done, and one or two were in the wrong
> boundaries: Thus Ork Traktor Kannon should be AT shots rather than FP2
> artillery, Squig Catapults should be Disrupts rather than FP2 artillery.
> The Ork Battlewagon simplification took a LOT of swallowing, but after
> much experimentation with having 4 different types of Battlewagon, I
> found there was no difference, IF had a proper Orky and individualistic
> army.
> Others (Hi, Agro!) consider the above Heretical, and won't even try
> E40K. Now I can understand someone playing 6 games of E40K and deciding
> SM2 is better (I'd disagree), but not even to try seems a little
> extreme. OTOH I'd rather play SM2 vs Agro than nothing. But as he's in
> Brisbane, this is unlikely.

Part of the reason why some people in New Zealand won't even play
Epic 40k is, I think, is a feeling of being cheat by GW. Their argument
is that just when they managed to build up a decent army GW goes and
changes the rules. While I can understand their feeling I can't agree
with them. I had built up a decent army and had to convert it to Epic
40k but I have found the effort is well worthwhile. I also think
that SM/TL was at a dead end, it had to many exceptions and who
won initiate determined who won the game. My impression is that
everybody agreed that the SM/TL rules needed a complete overall. I my
opinion GW has done an excellent job with Epic 40k. Ok I have a few
compliants about Epic 40k, particular its lack of movement bonus's
or reductions for moving through different types of terrain, but
overall I think the rules are great.

This has made me think of an idea for another thread, what about
compiling a list of all the things that need to be correct in Epic
40k. I think the following needed to be corrected:

- Movement bonus's and reductions for moving through different types
  of terrain,
- bunkers to be worth 1d6 morale if destroyed, instead of 5,
- vehicles should be able to use cover,
- units in fortifications should receive a -1 vs anti-tank and
  death rays.

P.S SM/TL I am not wanting to get into a argument about the merits of
    SM/TL vs Epic 40k, I just trying explain why some NZ players won't
    change over to Epic 40k and why I like Epic 40k.

Sean Smith
Received on Thu Jan 01 1970 - 00:00:00 UTC

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